Eating across the divide: ‘I kept telling him he was much more left-wing than he thought’ | Life and Style
Andrew, 55, Cheltenham
Profession Business owner
Voting behavior As a political atheist, he does not vote. In the past, he was more conservative
Amuse Bouche Is a big fan of John Pilger’s documentaries, especially his Iraq film The War You Don’t See
Steph, 36, Cheltenham
Profession Travel journalist
Voting behavior Would like to vote Labour but has only lived in a constituency where they had a chance, so usually votes Liberal Democrat
Amuse Bouche Once went rafting with ex-FARC guerrilla fighters
For starters
Andreas She is very nice, very sincere. Well-mannered. Intelligent.
Steph I was expecting someone who was pretty right-wing. And he wasn’t that at all. I kept telling him that he was much more left-wing than he thought. But to be honest, I still don’t know what his political leanings are.
Andreas I had steak.
Steph I had a shrimp and crayfish cocktail, followed by moules marinière and then a cheese platter.
The big beef
Steph Andrew kept telling me that he thought people needed to be given the opportunity to have a debate. It took him a long time to admit that he was talking about trans people; he kept talking about a “woke culture”. The media has hyped this up and used it as a weapon to sow discord. Trans people just want to be safe, have access to medical treatment and not be victims of the violence that has caused this situation. Otherwise, the issue is irrelevant to most people’s lives.
Andreas She said: “They just want to be left alone.” But I find that in the media it’s mostly trans women pushing their agendas. You rarely see a trans man complaining. The changing language, the pronouns – I’m not against it, I just think it’s going to take a long time to change people. When staff say ‘Good morning, ladies and gentlemen’ on the train and are punished for excluding nonbinary people – that’s going too far.
Steph I pointed out that change has to start somewhere and he said we should be allowed to discuss these things. I couldn’t get him to say clearly what he thought was up for debate.
Andreas I agree that it’s mostly people on the right who use “woke” to describe any argument that is supposed to be progressive. But Steph is expecting too much from society; the older generation needs to understand what it means to be different, whether it’s on the transgender issue or race.
after newsletter campaign
Sharing plates
Andreas We both believe that education is key. That was our common ground, even though we disagreed.
Steph We talked about private schools and agreed that they produced terrible Eton prime ministers. He didn’t like Boris Johnson at all. We talked about how the networks, the sense of entitlement and all the privileges that private schools give you are unjustified. But he’s sending his child to a private school in September.
Andreas The school we send him to is an elite school financially, but their ethos is child development. The facilities they have, the little quiet spaces, the mental health support – all of these things are things that children need more of in the modern world. Smaller classes, better facilities, guest speakers to inspire them. Maybe it’s the Conservative government or just the way they’re organised, but state schools don’t seem to try as hard.
For dessert
Steph He voted for Brexit because he thought we would have a greater degree of sovereignty, particularly over trade deals. I said we were more successful as part of a trading bloc. I understand his point that being part of the EU affects the level of control you have, but we were in such a delicate position. We were not part of the euro, we had significant privileges – I felt that was an own goal.
Andreas The accumulation of huge companies is what is ruining the world. Why would we want to do that to countries? I still think Brexit could work. I don’t think either party had the will to make it work. I wouldn’t say it was disastrous, but it was bad – I expected a lot more and was very disappointed.
Findings
Steph We both felt like we could be honest and that our opinions would be respected.
Andreas We really enjoyed the conversation, it was incredibly friendly. At the end we gave each other a quick hug.
Additional reporting: Kitty Drake
Andrew and Steph ate at Gallimores Kitchen in Cheltenham.
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